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August 10, 2004

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4 Mile Creek is a thoughtful blog by a U.S. officer in the Middle East - Much more of a writer than my "linker" style. Check it out. Oh yeah, and he is beating a horse that I am [Read More]

Comments

bkw

It makes my brain hurt to think that the Democrats are doing their best to get an admitted war criminal who committed atrocities in Vietnam elected President.

But, considering a sizeable portion of their base think Saddam should still be in power in Iraq, I guess it makes some kind of twisted sense.

I mean, if a war criminal is good enough for the Iraqi people, then gosh darn it, it's good enough for Americans!

Dewayne

accuracy is indeed a remarkable accomplishment among the flat-earth boggers given how rare they can achieve it.

lemme see...In the past several months a number of individuals, some of whom lug around some hefty ideological baggage, have been sought out and brought forward to question the accuracy of the official records and accounts of Kerry's conduct (which themselves were constructed at
the time by some of the very individuals attacking Kerry, to dispute the eyewitness accounts of those who were participants of the events, and to contradict the statements that several of the attackers have made over the intervening thirty-five years - statements consistent with the official records and Kerry's accounts. And the group has received funding from highly partisan sources. And attack is coming some three months from the presidential election. and these bogus bufoons are champions of credibility?

prove your assertions, cite you evidence.

and give it up. fuck it, a million or two vietnamese are terminated, many in free fire zones and in gi rages, and american vets are whining about their integrity being questioned? what is this, taking lessons from charlie manson?

sigh...

Pax D

Dewayne,

That's the only type of defense of these charges against Kerry I've been seeing. The ad hominem attack against the people saying it, and the complete disregard of the actual facts they are asserting.

From what I've read, the fact that Kerry lied to Congress about being in Cambodia on Christmas in 1968 is rock solid. The Congressional Record doesn't lie. As far as the charges about his medals go, the facts aren't in yet, but the shallow defenses presented by Kerry supporters are convincing me that the charges may be well founded. After all, why stoop to ad hominem attacks if you can factually refute the charges?

Dewayne

Ad Hominem? You simply don't know the meaning of the word. To be sure, I have no respect for those engaged in the attacks nor the lapdogs who traffic in their shit. In the end, those making the allegations have no evidence to support their claims. But I hardly think thats their goal.

Shallow defense? This is a bizarre Alice in Wonderland world! An offical record, eyewitness accounts by participants and contradictory statements by the attack dogs? At what point is any addtional defense required? At what point do you exhaust your credibility? At what point do you recognize the loss of your own critial facilities? At what point do you completely abort your own integrity for a Freeper worldview?

Beyond scoring points in a partisan political campaign it clears that the animus behind the vets is Kerry's anti-war activity. Winter soldering occurred. Live with it. Hell, atone for it! The anti-Kerry position right now smacks of the very thing it opposes. In fact, it is the very thing it attacks.

Cambodia? Lies? "...lied to Congress...? I smell Rovian talking points. Tenacity of attack does not make the attack more honorable or accurate.

rds

DeWayne:

The Swiftboat vets served allongside Kerry in other boats in the same place at the same time as he did. They were right there at all times relevant. And there are a lot of them.

The behavior of the left toward Pres. Bush has been so unbelievably disgusting, you have a lot of nerve attacking these guys.

DeWayne

how is that flat-earthers facility with skepticism is always so, how shall we say, episodic? these swiftboat bufoons were indeed there - many signed off on Kerry's medals! How is it that a $500,000 and three months til election made these guys all of sudden see things differently?

Oh, and I have a lot nerve questioning both the accuracy and motive of liars???

Being gullible is one thing, being aggressively gullible is another.

rds

DeWayne:

"Aggressively gullible" describes the party of Michael Moore, Richard Clarke, and Joe Wilson very well. Until you or someone else actually addresses the factual claims made by the Swiftbaot vets, those claims stand. They come across as regular guys and straight shooters in their ad. No reason for them to put their reputations on the line.

JAG

Apparently, DeWayne, you know a lot about guilibility so I won't argue with you on your expertise in this area.
But you do know that these veterans made these charges in May, do you not? You do know that Kerry's accounts of events have "inconsistencies" from author to author, article to article and have morphed over time, do you not?
Kerry has been given a free ride in the Boston media for decades over the medals issue, his service, his flip-flopping and feckless terms as Senator. Naturally, he imagined he could continue on this fudge factor.
Unfortunately for Kerry, the internet now exists to fact check him (and his accusers)till the cows come home. The Boston Globe can't protect him anymore and now he is being "victimized" by the first thorough examination of his version of events in his career.
Had the Globe done a better job, holding him accountable from day one, he might have learned long ago that he couldn't play this game successfully and actually tried to make something of his career. But they didn't and now the unforeseeable power of the internet to dredge up inconvenient facts, find and assemble widely dispersed groups of people to rebut anyone's "story" is his undoing.
Live by media protection...die by media protection.
Kerry's toast. He had no business running in the first place and wouldn't have seen the light of day without the spectre of his sugarlady's money looming over his candidacy.
Face it. He's a zero. Always was, always will be.

DeWayne

rds:

Freeper creepers, what does Michael Moore have to do with it! Your displaying something profoundly more disturbing than gullibility. Stupidity might describe it. An offical record, "factual claims" previously made by the accusers, eyewitness accounts - these guys are more than reglar - they're shooting straight from their asses! Of course, as the prez says, feces are where humans begin!

DeWayne

JAG:

Invoking the internet as strengthening the veracity of people's claims is a lot like saying Las Vegas will protect people's money. That these guys first performed in May means what? That one of them has recanted his recanting of recanting? sigh...


DeWayne

Breaking tho trivial news from the AP:

One of the authors of a new anti-John Kerry book frequently posted comments on a conservative Web site describing Muslims and Catholics as pedophiles and Pope John Paul (news - web sites) II as senile.

But as he prepared to launch the book, "Unfit for Command," Jerry Corsi apologized for the remarks in an interview with The Associated Press Tuesday, saying they were meant as a joke and he never intended to offend anyone.

In chat room entry last year on freerepublic.com, Corsi writes: "Islam is a peaceful religion — just as long as the women are beaten, the boys buggered and the infidels are killed."

In another entry, he says: "So this is what the last days of the Catholic Church are going to look like. Buggering boys undermines the moral base and the lawyers rip the gold off the Vatican (news - web sites) altars. We may get one more Pope, when this senile one dies, but that's probably about it."

Corsi, who described himself as a "devout Catholic," said the comments are being taken out of context. "I considered them a joke," said Corsi, who owns a financial services company and has written extensively on the anti-war movement.

In a March posting, Corsi discussed Kerry's faith, writing: "After he married TerRAHsa, didn't John Kerry begin practicing Judaism? He also has paternal grandparents that were Jewish. What religion is John Kerry?"

Kerry and his wife, Teresa Heinz Kerry, are Catholic.

"I don't stand by any of those comments and I apologize if they offended anybody," Corsi said.

-----------------------------------------------
Now, of course, Corsi's credibility or motives remain unimpeachable, just one of those regular guys who claims must stick. And this must be true - I read it on the internet!!

Zhang Fei

Dewayne: Now, of course, Corsi's credibility or motives remain unimpeachable, just one of those regular guys who claims must stick. And this must be true - I read it on the internet!!

It's not Corsi who have signed the sworn affidavits - it's 250 Swift boat vets who served alongside Kerry. I'll give Kerry the benefit of the doubt - the day he gets 250 Swift boat vets to vouch for him.

Zhang Fei

Dewayne: and give it up. fuck it, a million or two vietnamese are terminated, many in free fire zones and in gi rages, and american vets are whining about their integrity being questioned? what is this, taking lessons from charlie manson?

OK - so you are convinced that GI's are Nazi-style mass murderers. What you need is a lifetime vacation in the paradise that is now Vietnam, or a few months floating around in the shark-infested waters of the South China Sea.

Zhang Fei

The guys at Powerline Blog speculate on the origins of Kerry's fantasies about Cambodia:

What film loop do you suppose John Kerry has running in his cranium? Many think it might be "Apocalypse Now," with Kerry as Captain Willard (Martin Sheen) piloting the boat up the river on a secret mission to assassinate Colonel Kurtz in Cambodia. Reader James Phillips, for example, writes:

Does he think he was the skipper of that boat taking Martin Sheen to Colonel Kurtz? Could he really be delusional enough to have this movie "seared" into his mind as his own personal history? The horror...the horror.

DeWayne

Right wing echo echo echo chamber.

Zhang Fei

DeWayne: Right wing echo echo echo chamber.

Anti-Vietnam War leftists are a strange kind of xenophobe - they will believe the words of mass-murdering Vietnamese Communists, as well as Soviet Communist propagandists, over the words of their own veterans. Instead of hating foreigners, they hate America. They aren't actually self-haters, because if they really hated themselves for the despicable crimes they accused the veterans of, they'd kill themselves. No - who they hate is the rest of us - they're too good for the rest of us. I think they are too - which is why they should relocate to a place where they will presumably be welcomed - the former South Vietnam. Let's see how grateful the South Vietnamese are that people like Dewayne assisted in their liberation from their property and in many cases their lives (hundreds of thousands massacred after their defeat in 1975).

Diggs

Dewayne's comments prove out my very first sentence in the post.
Also the fourth sentence.
And especially the fifth sentence.
It's like I was reading his mind, even before he read my post.
Oh, and the next to last sentence in the post... that's confirmed in every single comment posted by DeWayne.
It's like shooting fish in a barrel.

sgt.sutton(usmc)

i think that kerry is a coward and that he does not desever to be presedent of our country he would run as soon as we had one problem. The guys in 3rd recon at quantico agree that kerry sghould never be allowed to make desicions for the country ever is he becomes presedent we are resighning our commision.

please call with comments (703)492-6853

spaceCADETzoom

is it just me or are some comments made for the sole purpose of a response? And is it just me, or does the above poster's offhand claim to be a Marine seem fishy?

DeWayne

the typing sure reeks of jarhead.

I guess Diggs is getting some of the high-quality rightwing argumentation that he's so fucking proud of. Yep, John Kerry is a bad man.

btw thats a home phone number for someone named Sutton.

spacecadetzoom

No, DeWayne, that's just the thing. It seems like a comment just to get "liberals" angry.

Let's not start throwing around "jarhead" when his message doesn't "reek" of the sort.

It's painfully obvious it was written by someone who has never been in the military...

THe very reason you don't see it, is the very reason the poster doesn't see it... Hint: it's not the message.

He's baiting you. To spell it out better: some zealot is trying to pose as a marine in order to reinforce the myth that all military folks are nuts.

Diggs

Not really sure who sgt.sutton is, but he isn't military. Anyone in the military knows that sergeants are non-commissioned officers, so resigning their "commission" isn't ever an option.
Posing as military to show you have the proper "cred" to then lambast the military is hardly new. But for those of us who know, it's pretty easy to discerne.
Like all the fake OEF/OIF vets in DCUs I see in pictures on various sites. There's something very different about our uniforms that can't be easily duplicated, at least not correctly. For someone who isn't actually in the military, it's hard to notice, like the fact that NCO (read "sergeant") stands for NON-commissioned officer. For those of us in the military, it sticks out like a sore thumb.
Bottom line, the person who signed sgt.sutton is not a sergeant.

Jay

Here's a short observation from a Kerry Voter.. I am not sure what happened back there in the vietnam war in a swift boat up some river I can't pronounce.. what I am sure of is what Predsident Bush has done with mistaken information about the WMD and the alquida link of the Iraqi leadership. Lots of fellow Americans I know which must be about half the country according to the Polls have decided that who ever ran against Bush was going to get our vote.. Too bad there arn't any really good politicians in any party. If this Kerry war hero is the best the Dems can come up with and Bush is the greatest Republican we can have as our leader..well... I guess we are in deep doo doo!

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